Another shave soap attempt

[Mschwartz]

I think I know what I did wrong but thought I’d ask. My recipe is 60% stearic acid, 15% lard, 15% coconut oil, 5% castor oil, 5% Shea butter. I added silk fibers to the lye water and 10% glycerin after mixing. I used a 33% lye solution with a 5:1 water ratio. The mixture seized up pretty quick. After further research I think my lye concentration is too high. I’m thinking of cutting it back to 25-28% and keeping the water ratio the same. Thanks

 

[AliOop]

Sorry, you have lost me. A 33% lye concentration is a 2:1 water:lye ratio. So when you say 5:1 water ratio, are you talking about water in relation to something other than lye?

 

[Mschwartz]

Sorry, you have lost me. A 33% lye concentration is a 2:1 water:lye ratio. So when you say 5:1 water ratio, are you talking about water in relation to something other than lye?

Sorry I’m actually still trying to decipher some of the soaping language. I used soapee’s calculator for the recipe. It gives you options on lye concentrations. I punched in 33% concentration and it gives you the option of changing the water ratio which I was suggested to make it 5:1. Further research I did says to lower your lye concentration and increase water for shave soaps?

 

[AliOop]

Lowering lye concentration is the same thing as increasing water. It's just two different ways of expressing the same concept.

So a 33% lye concentration equals a 2:1 water:lye ratio. I'm not a shave soap expert by any means, but with that much stearic, I'm assuming you are doing HP, which would definitely call for more water. Even my regular HP soaps (which don't have any stearic) are typically 25-28% lye concentration; 25% lye concentration would be a 3:1 water:lye ratio.

HTH. If you have read the shave soap threads here, there are some good tips about how you can keep the batter more workable.

 

[Mschwartz]

. This is the process I used which I guess is a modified hot process/cold process way of doing it.

 

[Mschwartz]

Zap test was good after 24 hours so I guess it’s just ugly not bad.

 

[AliOop]

Gad to hear that it turned out ok! How is the lather?

I finally got a minute to watch the video. Holly's recipe, as listed in the show notes, says that she used a 28% lye concentration. That would have made a substantial difference in how workable the batter would be, as compared to your 33%. I'd give that a try and see what you think.

A 5:1 water:lye ratio would only be a 17% lye concentration. Not sure who recommended that, or what recipe they might be using. That seems really, really low to me. Maybe they are doing full HP (added heat), which would lose more water during the process, or maybe their different ingredients call for more water to keep things workable. Given that shave soap is more advanced than bar soap, it's probably a good idea to stick with the lye concentration recommended for the specific recipe you are using. Hopefully you have a bunch of wet shavers who will work through those pucks quickly so you can experiment some more.

FYI, if you add the tag "Shave Soap" to your posts, it will get seen by some of those here like @The Efficacious Gentleman and @Professor Bernardo who have way more shave soap experience and expertise to offer than I do!

 

[Mschwartz]

Haven’t tried the lather quite yet. Was going to give it a try after about a week. I looked through a bunch of the archives. After rewatching that video I seen her lye concentration after the fact. Live and learn.

 

[AliOop]

Yup, part of the fun of making soap.

 

[user 49910]

A 5:1 water:lye ratio would only be a 17% lye concentration. Not sure who recommended that, or what recipe they might be using. That seems really, really low to me. Maybe they are doing full HP (added heat), which would lose more water during the process, or maybe their different ingredients call for more water to keep things workable.

That was probably me...

I make a "paste-type" of shave soap which lathers much more quickly than the hard cake type of shave soap. In addition, when I'm portioning it out into the jars for sale, I am able to use an ice cream scoop which makes it very easy to portion and such. The NaOH to KOH ratio is 15/85 percentage-wise.

After further research I think my lye concentration is too high. I’m thinking of cutting it back to 25-28% and keeping the water ratio the same.

Just increase the water percentage, basically the same. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

TBH - the ratio I use of distilled water to lye blend is: 5.666 / 1. It works... it just works. I base this off of purchasing other brands of shave soap which are selling upwards of $25 for a 5.4 oz. size tin/jar/tube... and comparing how soft or sticky the soap is. Then I fiddled around with my base formula and came up with that ratio. Plus there are a couple of other processes I use to get the mixture to a paste-type consistency.

I'm rather protective of my formulas due to the fact I sell them on Ebay.

 

[AliOop]

That was probably me...

I make a "paste-type" of shave soap which lathers much more quickly than the hard cake type of shave soap. In addition, when I'm portioning it out into the jars for sale, I am able to use an ice cream scoop which makes it very easy to portion and such. The NaOH to KOH ratio is 15/85 percentage-wise.


Just increase the water percentage, basically the same. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

TBH - the ratio I use of distilled water to lye blend is: 5.666 / 1. It works... it just works. I base this off of purchasing other brands of shave soap which are selling upwards of $25 for a 5.4 oz. size tin/jar/tube... and comparing how soft or sticky the soap is. Then I fiddled around with my base formula and came up with that ratio. Plus there are a couple of other processes I use to get the mixture to a paste-type consistency.

I'm rather protective of my formulas due to the fact I sell them on Ebay.

Thanks for explaining. It makes sense to use the higher water concentration for a paste-style shave soap. Do you have any water recommendations for the puck-style that the OP was making?

 

[Mschwartz]

That was probably me...

I make a "paste-type" of shave soap which lathers much more quickly than the hard cake type of shave soap. In addition, when I'm portioning it out into the jars for sale, I am able to use an ice cream scoop which makes it very easy to portion and such. The NaOH to KOH ratio is 15/85 percentage-wise.


Just increase the water percentage, basically the same. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

TBH - the ratio I use of distilled water to lye blend is: 5.666 / 1. It works... it just works. I base this off of purchasing other brands of shave soap which are selling upwards of $25 for a 5.4 oz. size tin/jar/tube... and comparing how soft or sticky the soap is. Then I fiddled around with my base formula and came up with that ratio. Plus there are a couple of other processes I use to get the mixture to a paste-type consistency.

I'm rather protective of my formulas due to the fact I sell them on Ebay.

Thanks for the replies. You were the one that recommended that video I believe. I combined oils and lye really hot. Like as soon as the lye cleared. I believe it was in the 168 range. It set up pretty quick.

 

[user 49910]

Thanks for explaining. It makes sense to use the higher water concentration for a paste-style shave soap. Do you have any water recommendations for the puck-style that the OP was making?

Yes, I upped the water to lye ratio to a 3.5/1 that way it was easier for me to pour the mixture into the 3" cylinder mold I was using. Much easier to work with.

Thanks for the replies. You were the one that recommended that video I believe. I combined oils and lye really hot. Like as soon as the lye cleared. I believe it was in the 168 range. It set up pretty quick.

I combined the oils quite hot too, watching out for the ever present "volcano" which did not occur. Up your water ratio to lye and you should be good to go.

Working with so much stearic acid can be tricky sometimes.

I recommend starting with a half-batch size so that way if something goes FUBAR you're not losing as much product.