A little too harsh

Soapmaking Forum

Help Support Soapmaking Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

GeorgeG

Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2018
Messages
14
Reaction score
6
My first couple of soap formulas are a little too cleansing/harsh. I only have about two weeks on the cure so that may get better but I would like to find a formula more to our liking. I have been working with OO, palm oil and coconut oil. The CO is always 25%, except the 100%/20% SF CO bars. Should I try lowering the CO percent content or experiment with the addition of one of the conditioning oils like shea butter, castor oil, etc?

Thanks,

George
 
What is the rest of your formula?

Longer, cure of course, but the total formula also is important in determining how stripping your soap might be. Is it the same recipe you mention here? If so, it needs a much longer cure. And don't ignore DeeAnna's comments about that high of a SF. Or is it the 3 oil soap listed here? Still don't know the formula for that one, so that's important. By using PKO and CO together in the same formula you are increasing the lauric and myristic acid (stripping) of your formula. Refer back to DeeAnna's post in that other thread about what that does to some people when soap is made with oils high lauric and myrstic acids.

Yes, I would absolutely lower the CO percent as you've been advised, AND I'd also lower the PKO as well. Both together can be quite harsh, depending on your exact formula. Sure, I'd add some shea, but I wouldn't use more than 10%, although some go higher. Castor I would not use more than 5%, but I usually only use 3% when I use castor. Some use a bit more.

What other oils are readily available to you? It might help in order for members here to give you suggestions of how to better tweak your current formulas.
 
My formulas so far:

1) 50% EVOO, 25% palm kernel oil, 25% CO, 5% SF

2) 100% CO, 20% SF

3) 78% pure OO, 22% CO, 5% SF

4) 40% palm oil, 35% pure OO, 25% CO, 5% SF

I currently also have some rice bran oil on hand.

George
 
You don't need extra virgin olive oil for soap. You can try using 20% coconut oil, 7% Castor oil, 20% palm oil or lard, 53% olive oil with an 8% superfat. That will give you a milder soap that has some bubbles.
 
Two things I've learned from the wonderful people on this forum. Actually three.

1. Coconut oil 20% or less
2. Longer cure time will make a soap more gentle. I make a 50% tallow, 20% coconut, 25% olive and 5% castor that was very drying when I tried it at three weeks-ish, and I was very dismayed, but cured properly for 8-12 weeks its one of my favourites and not drying at all
3. For sensitive skin, it is better to have a less stripping soap, that leaves the natural oils on the skin, than to strip it and try to replace with non-human fats in a high superfat. Makes total sense to me and my formulas have benefited from this theory.
 
I want to stick with vegetable oil.

I'll keep giving my bars time. Meanwhile today I went:
15% CO
50% PO
35% OO
5%SF

If that still doesn't do it I'll increase the SF.

I only used EVOO the one time. Now I use pure OO from SAMs. I only used PKO once before I realized that this is not PO.

Thanks,

George
 
For my skin, I'd drop the total of CO + Palm KERNEL to 15% or less. I don't care for high lauric+myristic in my soap. I have elderly skin and it just doesn't respond well to that. Plus I don't always use CO in soap. My skin is happy without it, but very unhappy with too much. The only exception I have found to this is soap with added egg yolk when the CO is higher.

I would use more RBO. I like Rice Bran oil and will sub it for OO anytime I don't care if the soap is totally white. For coloring though, I find that high percentage of RBO does mute and alter the colors that appear more vibrant and true to color in OO soaps.

Regarding SF, I would not go above the default setting already built into lye calculators. In fact, I generally change the default, using 2% or 3% SF. We already know that the numbers are only a range anyway and that default leads us to a higher SF than what we plug in there because no NaOH is ever going to be 100% pure.
 
PKO was a mistake as I didn't realize that it's not PO. I'm on to proper PO now. will try RBO in my next batch.

Thanks,

George
 
Are you completely against using animal fats? If not, lard and tallow make excellent soap that is far less stripping than I find palm oil with coconut and olive oils to be.
Do you have a recipe that you can share? I’ve been using coconut and olive oil and my skin is very dry and itchy. I’m wondering if it’s the coconut.
 
Do you have a recipe that you can share? I’ve been using coconut and olive oil and my skin is very dry and itchy. I’m wondering if it’s the coconut.

This is my favorite recipe range for all times, and it is completely modifiable to your specific needs:

Lard (either alone or with the GV shortening below) 40-65%
GV shortening with animal and vegetable fats (tallow and palm) optional, but I like it 0-25%
Olive Oil 15-20%
Coconut Oil 10-20%
Castor Oil 5%
Superfat 5%
Sugar 14 g PPO (per pound of oil)

I would use straight lard to start (don't use the GV shortening at all). With the Olive Oil and Coconut Oil at 15% each. Then try the OO at 20%, then the CO at 10%, etc. Once you get the OO and CO sorted out to what you like, you can then try substituting some of the GV shortening for some of the lard, etc.
 
Susie's recipe idea above is a great start for sure. My recipe make-up is very similar to her suggestion. I personally don't like high OO and add in high CO and my skin would absolutely hate it. Though I don't mind 25% CO.
 
Does anyone have experience with this issue of too much cleansing/drying and using the same formula as a HP batch vs a CP batch. I'm trying to figure out if I will be better served on my next try to switch to CP or keep trying new formulas.

Thanks,

George
 
Does anyone have experience with this issue of too much cleansing/drying and using the same formula as a HP batch vs a CP batch. I'm trying to figure out if I will be better served on my next try to switch to CP or keep trying new formulas.

Thanks,

George
It should just be the same. HP vs CP does not change what the ingredients do in the soap.
 
Does anyone have experience with this issue of too much cleansing/drying and using the same formula as a HP batch vs a CP batch. I'm trying to figure out if I will be better served on my next try to switch to CP or keep trying new formulas.

Thanks,

George


I don't notice any difference between CP & HP with the same recipe other than the look of the bar. The performance is the same with the recipes I have used.
 
If you have Palm Kernel Oil on hand you can split the CO with PKO, which I happen to really like in soap. I usually only use 15-17% total oils such as CO and/or PKO. Babassu is also another bubble maker oil but I find it to expensive for soap. I add in some sugar to help with fluffy bubbles
 
I usually use 25% coconut oil with an 8% super fat. That is fine for my skin and most who use it. So if you want to stay at 25% try increasing your super fat a bit.
 
This is my favorite recipe range for all times, and it is completely modifiable to your specific needs:

Lard (either alone or with the GV shortening below) 40-65%
GV shortening with animal and vegetable fats (tallow and palm) optional, but I like it 0-25%
Olive Oil 15-20%
Coconut Oil 10-20%
Castor Oil 5%
Superfat 5%
Sugar 14 g PPO (per pound of oil)

I would use straight lard to start (don't use the GV shortening at all). With the Olive Oil and Coconut Oil at 15% each. Then try the OO at 20%, then the CO at 10%, etc. Once you get the OO and CO sorted out to what you like, you can then try substituting some of the GV shortening for some of the lard, etc.
Sounds great! Thanks so much, I will start here, can I add Shea where you would use the shortening or is that too soft of a butter? Also when do I add the sugar?
 
Sounds great! Thanks so much, I will start here, can I add Shea where you would use the shortening or is that too soft of a butter? Also when do I add the sugar?

You can use shea butter but I wouldn't recommend using more that 10% or so. Too much will cut lather. Add the sugar to your lye water and dissolve before adding your lye. I don't use shortening but many do. I really prefer lard.
 
I look for a cleansing value BELOW the low end on the recommended level on lye calculators.
I personally find that any cleansing value above 11 or so is drying to my skin.
Your reaction to the soap may simply be that you are taking too much of the natural oils off.
If you raise the SF without lowering the cleansing value you will be leaving surface oils from the soap on skin stripped of it's natural oils. Still "dry feeling". If you lower the cleansing value and leave the SF alone you will not be stripping as much oil from the skin.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top