so what happened??

I did a salt bar on my fourth batch of cp soap. It's been a 7 week cure. It got worse with age::thumbdown:
I did 100% salt ppo. I did
CO 80% @9.6oz
Rice Bran 15% @1.8 oz
Shea 5% @ .6 oz

Total 12oz oils

18% SF (slightly more than. Lye was 1.694 oz/48.05 grams and I did 48 solid grams)
Water was full water at 38% default soapcalc or 4.56 oz/129.274 grams.

Wow. Just wow. I reread notes. So this my batch # 4 (onto batch over 10 now and rereading notes now as I type......)

Well I used avocado puree at 26 grams of the 130 grams water, and dissolved lye into 104 grams water.

So this batch also contained avocado puree 26 of a total 130 grams water.

Point? NO lather. At all whatsoever. It's so bad, it needs to be tossed. Can anyone give me insight on this?? It's purely unusable. So freakin old and dad gum hard, I can't possibly rebatch now. Sooo lack of any lather, that it does nothing.

Maybe a weapon in a sling shot is all its good for?????

I'm not a salt bar expert....but how many times did you try to lather it?

I did a salt experiment and the first time I tried the first bar it didn't lather well. I wrote it off as a loss of 1 pound of HP soap batter. But later that day I went to wash my hands and I grabbed it again, and this time it lathered better, and it continued to lather really well for me.

But that very first time, I don't know why, the lather wasn't impressive.

I have some salt bars that don't lather well until the third or fourth use. I'd recommend using a bath poof and see if you can work up a lather.

It's a bear to do, but it can be rebatched. If you have a food processor, run it through the shredder blade. A salad shooter, or even a parmesan grater works too. I would rebatch it half and half with a 100% coconut oil soap superfatted at 5-10%. It won't look or feel quite the same but it will still be nice and still be usable.

May I suggest that for salt bars you try something a little simpler? I still use IrishLass' recipe, it doesn't need anything else IMO.

100% coconut oil
100% coconut milk for liquid
13% superfat (in the lye calculator, this does not include the fat in the coconut milk, which will raise your total SF)

25% salt (by weight of oils)

I would also recommend single cavity molds, SO much easier than trying to cut bars. If you don't have a mold, yogurt cups or whatever you have on hand will do nicely.

eta: I guess a lot of us posted at once! I have never had that problem, my salt bars always lather like crazy right from the moment I make them. In the case of the OP I really suspect is it overly superfatted, but you may be right and they may improve with time and use.

I used single cavity molds.
I lathered it day 2, 6, 7/8, 12, 14, 20, 22, 23, 26, 32, 38 etc etc.
It was bad, it got worse, and it's now horrid.

To newsoap... sorry on name mixups. My next bar of salt was going to be (after reflection of this disaster and my numbers I've run..)
70% CO
5% castor
25% either olive, almond or rice bran

70% salt ppo NOT 100% again lol!
*no butters again!
and no additives.
Increase SF from 18%+ to full 20-22%

This was my fix for the mess I figured I'd attempt next. Any opinions welcomed!

Both salt and superfat are lather inhibitors, so if you want more lather lower the salt (as in your recipe above) and perhaps lower the superfat? I mistakenly made a 5% SF salt bar, and its more cleansing than 20% SF certainly, but really not as drying as I expected - I call it my grubby paws soap. I was surprised that I don't need lotion after I use it. One of the "big kids" here ( I can't remember who) doesn't use more than 15% superfat in her salt bars, and I see Irish Lass doesn't either.

what type of salt did you use? Shea will also inhibit lather. They can be grated up and added to another batch. In such case I would go with 100% coconut oil with 15% superfat and add in the grated salt bars. It will grate up fairly fine. You can add in more salt if you want to

I made 100% CO salt bars with 20% superfat, and it lathers like crazy.

My understanding is that 100% CO is used just because of the lather.

You've been given advice that seems to work for folks ... and you asked for it, why not use it? You had poor results doing it your way the first time, and the second recipe you say you are going to try is just a slight modification of your first, and night and day away from what's been recommended. You're using 3x more salt than a proven recipe, and increasing your superfat over your last failed recipe ... I don't know it sorta seems like you just needed a journal and not advice. I may be wrong.

I've found that shea and avocado oil both inhibit lather in my salt bars, I won't use either anymore. My absolute favorite salt recipe is 80% CO, 15% OO and 5% castor with a SF of 20%. I use 50%-75% salt but even with 100% salt I get great lather.
Using beer will add to the lather too. I don't believe a high SF affects lather that much. I have a salt bar with 25% SF and it lathers just fine.
As for what to do with your super hard bars. Get yourself a microplane and grate your bars into a fine powder, place the powder into a shaker jar and use it for hand soap. If nothing else, put it away for a few more weeks then try again. Salt bars are weird, I find almost all mine go through a really crappy stage but they improve with age. I cure mine a minimum of 8 weeks but 12 is even better.

So there is hope for my salt bars! Good to know, as on first try I was not impressed.

Hey Lee. I was just telling my 'original' fix in my head, just to share. There is great advice, and boy you bet I plan to read over it and do one of it. I love the idea of beer in it, and the idea of powder in hand soap. Interesting.

Thx for the awesome advice.

Oh, Carolyn! Forgot, used iodine free fine table salt. wanted non scratchy and read bad things about dead sea salt.

New12, also, it felt very drying and tight like. Shoudve mentioned it. So I figured I may be one that's more sensitive to CO (thus the idea 100% CO recipe may not jive with my skin Lee ;-)). Really don't know, I have a drying problem at 22% CO SF at 8%, so 100% CO with C milk not sure how I will handle it.

Didn't I read some are more sensitive to CO?? I am grateful for each of your perspectives. Thx again!!

lionprincess00 said:

Hey Lee. I was just telling my 'original' fix in my head, just to share. There is great advice, and boy you bet I plan to read over it and do one of it.

Click to expand...

Okay, was just wondering.

In another pastime of mine we have a very learned person who participates on the discussion forums. He quotes .. someone, and I'll get it not exactly right but basically it's "To learn, one must first do as others have done." I translate it as "do a known good and THEN modify it once you understand it."

It's always worked for me, but I often have to remind myself of it when I get too excited.

Thx for your perspective. It is easy to ignore advice and make our own decisions/mistakes, not just on a forum but in real life!
It's all great advice, and I do plan to have another go at it. I'm waiting on salty mariner and a sample of sea moss from bb, so I am gung ho to retry this!!!

Salty mariner accelerates so be prepared. Its a fantastic scent though, so worth the trouble.

Any of the salty type fo's I find accelerating

I read the same thing. Salt and floral accelerate. Thx!

Candy cane and Christmas spice

new12soap said:

I still use IrishLass' recipe, it doesn't need anything else IMO.

100% coconut oil
100% coconut milk for liquid
13% superfat (in the lye calculator, this does not include the fat in the coconut milk, which will raise your total SF)

25% salt (by weight of oils)

Click to expand...

I'm so glad to hear you are still enjoying it! I'm still enjoying it, too.

I started out with Iben's original recipe of 100% CO/100% salt as per oils although I added a 10% superfat to mine instead of her 5%. And then I took it from there and just kept experimenting and playing around until I came up with the above, and I've never looked back. That's the one for me.

I've found that salt bars can be somewhat difficult (or easy) to lather depending on several factors, i.e., the hardness level of one's water, the coconut oil to salt ratio in the formula, not to mention any other oils/fats that might be used in the formula in relation to the coconut amount, salt amount, and superfat level. It's a delicate balancing act for sure.

And you can add on top of that how parched or lotion-y your hands are when you go to use it at the sink. I found that with my 100% CO/100% salt bars that if any excess oils were on my hands from having applied lotion to them fairly recently, it wouldn't lather at all, but as soon as the excess oil was washed away, it would lather just fine.

As far as the cleansing/drying effect of using 100% coconut oil- the first time I ever used a salt bar (made with 100% CO/100% salt/10% S/F), I was amazed at how non-drying it felt. I used it all over myself in the shower and I came out with my skin feeling surprisingly refreshed & hydrated instead of dry/tight. For me, I find the presence of salt in these things really helps to tame the drying coconut beast.

Although the 100% CO/100% salt formula lathered just fine for me in my hard water, I wanted more lather (because I'm an unrepentant bubble lover, dagnabit) and I wanted for it to be able to lather easily in any kind of water, and so I played around with the salt and superfat levels to see how much bubblage I could obtain from using as little of an amount salt as possible, while still having my soap be recognizable as a salt bar, but leave me feeling refreshed instead of dry.

And that's how I came up with my formula.

My favorite scent to use in these things is Salty Sailor from Daystar. Yes- it does move fast, but I'm quicker. :wink:


IrishLass

IrishLass, is that 100% coconut milk replacing water?

33% lye concentration? Any issues mixing lye with the coconut milk?

Kosher? Table salt?