Researching before making soap:)

I can not understand why people post constantly questions about the simplest things. Why they do not acquire at least basic knowledge about making soap. It is as easy as to click -->Forum--> search bar on left hand side and put it in what ever question one does have.
English is my second language and I learned everything I know here on this forum. Every other forum is just too snotty and does not share like here.
I am getting upset with volume measurement and the same question all over again. I admire people here, you are the most patient group of people , I had ever met on internet.
It is my first thread here, I would love to know your opinions about it
Thank you

I agree 100% It has been a bit frustrating lately. Especially those who just want everyone to give them a recipe so that they can make awesome soap with no work. I spent months researching on this forum and another one. This one was the friendliest and most helpful so I stayed here.

There is an enormous amount of information available on this forum if folks just do a little work. Then if there are still questions, ask away. Lately the questions have been so basic and it's maddening.

Then after a few weeks many will be selling their soaps, which is a whole different issue.

I think making the soap without any experience and start selling it , even without proper 8 weeks or more of curing , it is just irresponsible.

I admit, I read a lot of the old posts going back at least 10 pages when I started out. Took away most (but not all ) of the obvious questions.

But as you say, not everyone does and it can get a little bit old. I sometimes lose my temper a little and get frustrated, but I like how we all generally keep each other on the level a little bit, too.

shunt2011 said:

Then after a few weeks many will be selling their soaps, which is a whole different issue.

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True, but people don't listen Shunt, and if you try to tell them why it's a bad idea, they think you don't want competition, or that you are trampling their hopes and dreams.

The only real thing that gets me is that they will fail, usually spectacularly and then they think it has to be the industry or the economy rather than their lack of knowledge that has caused their failure.

I was called snarky today for pointing out someone's lack of knowledge and plans to sell! Honestly I laughed when I read it because snarky I was not, however I'm fully capable of it. ( I wonder what they would have said if I really was snarky!!)

In short I think I'm going to wash my hands of commenting on posts that I know are super new to making soap and want to sell. I figure just let them go, maybe a few of them will learn and grow from their mistakes and take advice without getting offended. The rest will be gone before long.

Everyone here is SO MEAN!! I want to use my great grandmothers recipe using shot glasses as measures and her sacred recipe that involves raisins, uncooked pasta, grappa and chicken skin. I plan to sell it as soon as it firms up. I had just ONE question about how to stop it dripping after 3 days, and everyone butted into the thread with opinions that I did NOT ask for!! I will never post here again!!!!1!!!

<cue dramatic flounce>

mrsbrightside said:

As a newbie I find this thread vaguely rude. Yes, I did my research and came up with my own recipe and Lord knows where anyone finds a soap recipe measured in volume, but heck, people have to start learning somewhere. And if they're asking, then at least they're trying to learn from their mistakes. I'm sure I've asked or said something deemed stupid on here by someone, but I asked; and now I know. Everyone has been helpful. I truly don't think there's such a thing as a stupid question & saying there is might hinder people from asking for help in the future. As for people that want to sell right away, they're probably not going to listen to opinions telling them not to regardless & they either will or won't. Soaping is exciting, but people that truly have a passion for it will outlast those that don't.

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I was going to stay out of this thread until I read this. I need to correct a couple of misconceptions for you.

Yes, they are learning. Yes, we understand that. Yes, we are patient and thorough with the people who truly want to learn and demonstrate that with at least a rudimentary knowledge of any part of soapmaking. See the many, many threads that we repeat the same information over and over as proof of this.

Even if someone comes brand new to the forum with only the willingness to learn, we will step up and help. I will go dig out every last video I found helpful and link every sticky of the forum I know they need. And I am not alone. Most of us are more than happy to help! You just would not understand the rush I get when someone makes that first batch of soap that turns out well, and I know I had some small part of helping them learn.

However, we have had a few people lately that are not really wanting to learn. They want us to tell them how to fix a bad recipe, and nothing else. Then, when we explain the whole of what is wrong with what they did, they do not take it well. And then they call us names, or make baseless accusations that are patently untrue. Usually these are spread out a bit more, but we have just had some too close together.

Worst of all, however, are the ones who absolutely refuse to learn. After asking us to help, and asking our opinions, they refuse. There's not much we can do to help those. Unfortunately, those are the very ones who think they can crank soap out and make LOTS OF MONEY RIGHT NOW!!!

The OP of this thread is a brand new soaper(who hasn't even made a batch yet!) who took the time to do the research to avoid asking questions that have been answered over and over. Kudos to them! We can wish for many, many more of those types of folks! Until then, though, we would prefer to help those that truly want our help.

mrsbrightside, no one has a problem with questions like you have asked and yes, everyone has to start some where. Its more of the "I've never made soap and have a order to fill by next week so I need a recipe" type posts that are so very annoying.
In defense of newbies though. they don't know that soap is so complicated and that recipes can take so much time/money to perfect. They probably think its like baking a cake and there are simple, basic recipes that will turn out wonderful and be sell-able right away.

When I started, I had no idea you couldn't use volume measures. That how I had seen it done as a child so I though that was how it was still done. I got schooled and not in a necessarily nice way. It almost drove me away from the site as I felt attacked when I was very excited and just wanted to learn.

Yes, its easy enough to search the site but you need to have a idea what you are searching for. I didn't know handmade soap was so popular so it never crossed my mind to go on youtube to watch instruction videos. If you don't know ingredients need to be weighed, how can you seek out info for that? Google really doesn't help as there is a ton of horrible instructions on soap making, how to know the good from the bad.

If I see a post that makes me unhappy, I simple don't answer. I also don't assume that when someone says they want to sell, that they mean it will be immediately. I've seen some people say they want to eventually sell, once they get a good product and people still jump all over them and are often quite rude about it.

I really do think there are times that people should keep their opinions about selling to themselves. Unless someone posts that they are going to sell their first batch or some other silliness, stop assuming that they are going to sell their beginning soaps.

Kudos to mrsbrightside! I'm a newbie as well.I've sat many an hour playing contentedly on soap calc. I've spent hours watching youtube videos. I have a library of well read soaping books.I've gone back on this website for page upon page researching the topics that interested me or were pertinent.I've also made a lot of soap, replete with mistakes. I have received a lot of help on this website and have gleaned some wonderful information. I thank everyone that has responded to my questions.With that said, several things come to mind.Perhaps we can as a group to simply ask people to do some more research on their own. For instance, for someone using volume as opposed to weight simply state that this would be a difficult recipe to share. For those looking for THE perfect soap recipe let us remember we live in a time of immediate gratification. For those looking to sell their soaps very early on in their soap making careers I refer back to the immediate gratification statement.We are also not living in what I would call boom times; a lot of people are struggling economically and are looking for an additional money stream.30 years ago I became familiar with what PITA stands for...maybe we can come up with something similar to GENTLY encourage people to do more homework. Lastly,as in some groups it is said;"take what you need and leave the rest". Years from now, I hope I can be of as much help to someone else as you all have been to me. 'Nuff said!

Susie I made already many batches of soap ) two years already : ) remember the liquid soap?

Regarding rudeness, I have to say that when people start a post that is answered, not on the second or third or 10th page of the forum, but on the very first page! Many people seem to not even read other threads other than what they themselves create. There is a huge difference between people who want to learn and those who just want to be given everything on a platter and are willing to do next to no work at all themselves.

Please don't confuse it with someone starting out. As you can see, I am also not overly long here and it was my first (and only) soaping forum. When I started, I read a lot of old and new posts, then I asked for feedback on my first proposed recipe, filling in the blanks and correcting misunderstood parts. There is a very big difference between the two methods, I am sure you will agree.

Why do people ask the "simple" questions?

For many, many different reasons. Some are lazy and want you to tell them step by step.

Some are looking for confirmation of what they have learned; after all how many times are we told that you can't believe everything on the internet???

Some people are insecure and by making "contact" on a forum...and "hearing" something from a living breathing human being....they can move on from there.

Some people are NOT visual learners...and watching the best soaping vids from YouTube do nothing for them.

Some forums (especially frequented by the younger generation) are filled with people who ask basic, simple, and/or stupid questions. It's the culture on some forums. Not here - but it takes hours of reading to catch on to the culture here.

People research in different ways. I know what to do with a card catalog, but less friendly with computer research because I don't know how to judge a good source well.

And there's other reasons I'm sure.

Did I mention that some people are lazy?

Oh, and I've wanted to say this for a long, long time but was afraid to. For those new soap makers who want ignore good advice, or want to start selling right away....let them. Most humans learn best by mistakes. Most only hear what they want to hear, and will do what they want anyway.

Let them make their choices and fail. They'll either give up totally, or work harder and better.

^^^
I am more than willing and happy to help folks. Even really new people. What irritates me is the people who consistently are asking for recipes without doing any research what so ever. And those who make a few batches and ask if they are okay enough to sell. I've helped many people here, as well as in real life. I'm not afraid of competition of any sort. I stand behind what I have created that took me a boatload of time, effort and research. I read almost every single post here in the beginners & soap forum. I wanted to know as much as I possibly could and there is so much helpful information here alone.

I will almost always offer help to a poster. However, if I see they aren't listening and continue to ask the same kind of questions when they've been given answers to but choose to ignore it because they aren't hearing or getting the answer they want. I will walk away from the conversation and not post anymore

We were all new at some point. I don't think anyone is being rude in any way, just stating facts as they see them.

lenarenee said:

...........................Oh, and I've wanted to say this for a long, long time but was afraid to. For those new soap makers who want ignore good advice, or want to start selling right away....let them. Most humans learn best by mistakes. Most only hear what they want to hear, and will do what they want anyway.

Let them make their choices and fail. They'll either give up totally, or work harder and better.

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While that would be great, the problem is the impact that has in the meantime. Imagine if you wanted to sell but everyone had already tried a bar of soap from someone who was not selling good soap - no one would want to by your product because every product they tried before turned out to be either rubbish or caused them injury.

If they listen or not, I will still say it. The rest is up to them. One thing I will NOT do, though, is help them except to prevent them doing something outright dangerous.

Brand new member

I just joined yesterday. Have been soaping for past 4 months. Already 10 almost Successful batches old before I even thought of googling " soap forums". whatever I have learnt was by reading blogs and watching videos mostly beginner ones. I made sure I knew all the basics before I started, have all the basic oils and lye and safety equipment ready. All my soaps have been my own recipes or some promising ones which I tweaked.
Having said all that, I have gone through many threads on this forum in the last 3 days. am already familiar with some of the most helpful names, Susie anyone?A wealth of information if one knew how to look. I'm going to learn how to search myself and I know there is a thread for that as well.
But it is my experience that not every one has the kind of time I have, not everyone is as click happy as I am, not everyone has harnessed the power of Google and most importantly not as inclined to learn the ways of learning if you know what I mean.
So I'm grateful that such learner questions are being met with such kindness on this forum, either fully answered or gently redirected. because they do need to learn, for the sake of their customers. To those who want everything on a platter, I say please pay it forward as you do get it from some really kind members.

I don't have a problem with the "basic" questions because when you first start out, you don't even know the questions to ask. I have seen soda ash described in SO many ways here - as a rind, a crust, white stuff, weird white stuff on top, etc. Same thing with gel. Not using aluminum is "common" knowledge, which is why it's not mentioned very frequently, so you have people making soap in aluminum bread pans. IME, most soap making books are not particuarly good b/c they are long on pretty pictures and lovely descriptions and short on A+B=C explanations of things.

I've been on the internet a long, long time and hear this complaint about newbies on many different subjects. I answer questions. I put together a new soaper blog post that I give to people to help get them started. You know the ones who are seeking vs. the ones who want a handout. I prefer to focus on the former.

Dahila said:

Susie I made already many batches of soap ) two years already : ) remember the liquid soap?

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Sorry, honey! I have the flu, and I am just not functioning well this week. Please forgive me!

I have all the patience in the world for questions - we were all newbies once.

However my patience wears thin when someone has an agenda other than learning about soap and some general principles, and insists we deliver the information that they require immediately!

Every forum, blog, website and internet space has its own culture, its always a good idea to read around, get a feel for it and read the stickies for the forum you are posting in.

mrsbrightside said:

To clarify my statement of saying this thread was "vaguely rude", I wasn't trying to attack any of the posters before me . I actually read a post earlier today where someone had made soap using volume measurements and couldn't figure out why it wasn't setting up right, and then this thread showed up not long after. If I was that person seeing this thread I wouldn't be able to help feeling miffed-whether it was directly intended at me or not. Typed words can come off wrong to some people and the tone can easily be misunderstood. I agree with lenarenee on why ppl post seemingly stupid questions. Company, commiseration, validation, attention...sometimes I wonder if they're gag questions lol. I didn't realize people had asked for help and then bad mouthed those that input...I'm sorry if my response came off so critical in that case. But there is a fine line between complaining and gossiping and sarcasm and rudeness. Everyone that has responded to my questions has been super helpful, especially 2-3 people & I'm so grateful for that. If there are stupid people on the forum they'll weed themselves out before long...

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I really didn't think you were being "so critical". I thought you were asking/making a statement about exactly what you were trying to say. Which, if I had been fairly new, would be exactly my own reaction. However, I have been on this side of that conversation for a while now. And I have had my fair share of being called names and confronted for giving truth to someone who did not want it. But I am not going to let folks like that scare me off. I am going to hang in there and help and explain to anyone who wants my/our help.

I thought you honestly needed to understand what is going on that folks would react like they did. And that you really would learn from what we said. You have already proven yourself as one who wants to learn and will apply that knowledge. We want to help folks like you, truly!