Tallow and Lard

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michael_schaap

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Hi there. My name is Michael and this is my first post. I have just been reading book on and off over the years. I actually got most of the ingredients some time ago but did not make the soap. Just found the ingredients yesterday actually! Everything is there. Need to get maybe one of two things. This book I have has a basic recipe I wanted to try. I have Lard on hand now and the recipe calls for Tallow. Can these two be exchanged?

The recipe is:

Tallow 74 oz
Oil 32oz
CoCoa butter 3 oz
Lye 14oz
Water 41oz


The ingredients I have on hand are:

Lard
Olive Oil
Coconut Oil
Lye


So what would this soap be like if I just used the ingredients I have on hand? Exchanging the Lard for Tallow and the Coconut Oil for Cocoa butter?

Thanks a million!

Michael
 
Hi Micheal and welcome!

You can make a nice bar of soap with just those ingredients, but you will need to run it through a lye calculator. Not all oils and fats have the same SAP rate (amount of lye it takes to saponify the fat/oil). For that reason, you cannot simply substitute without adjusting the lye amount. I like this soap calculator:

http://www.soapcalc.net/calc/SoapCalcWP.asp

Based on the oils you have on hand, I'd try this combo:

CO 25%
Lard 40%
OO 35%

If you can get some castor oil, you can also add that. It makes a more sudsy soap. I'd do 5 - 10% and take that amount from the OO...run it through the lye calc if you sub.

Also, I'd start with a 2lb batch (weight in oils) and do a lye discount from 5 - 7%.

Good luck and let us know how it goes!
 
Wow! Great program. I'm a little confused about the block #3. I'll be using Lye.... right now it says water as a % of oils 38%. Do I want to change this?

Michael




NancyRogers said:
Hi Micheal and welcome!

You can make a nice bar of soap with just those ingredients, but you will need to run it through a lye calculator. Not all oils and fats have the same SAP rate (amount of lye it takes to saponify the fat/oil). For that reason, you cannot simply substitute without adjusting the lye amount. I like this soap calculator:

http://www.soapcalc.net/calc/SoapCalcWP.asp

Based on the oils you have on hand, I'd try this combo:

CO 25%
Lard 40%
OO 35%

If you can get some castor oil, you can also add that. It makes a more sudsy soap. I'd do 5 - 10% and take that amount from the OO...run it through the lye calc if you sub.

Also, I'd start with a 2lb batch (weight in oils) and do a lye discount from 5 - 7%.

Good luck and let us know how it goes!
Click to expand...
 
I never change that, but some more advanced soapers like to discount the water (have a more concentrated lye solution). Discounting water shortens the cure time because there is less water that needs to evaporate leaving a hard bar of soap. However, discounting water will speed up trace and is more dangerous because you will be working with an even more caustic solution. I don't recommend it for those of us who are new.
 
Hmmm....

Must be doing something wrong..... can't seem to find where it says how much Lye to use and how much water to use......oh wait.... the 3rd box... it must be asking me how much that I plan to use there and figure out the oils from what I have said.... be back :)
 
Here is what I got if I use beef tallow

Ingredient Pounds Ounces Grams
Water 1.758 28.124 797.303
Lye - NaOH 0.586 9.375 265.768
# √ Oil/Fat % Pounds Ounces Grams
1 Tallow Beef 23.08 0.938 15 425.243
2 Olive Oil 46.15 1.875 30 850.485
3 Coconut Oil, 92 deg 30.77 1.25 20 566.99
Totals 100 4.063 65 1842.718
Hardness 29 - 54 46
Cleansing 12 - 22 22
Conditioning 44 - 69 50
Bubbly 14 - 46 22
Creamy 16 - 48 23
Iodine 41 - 70 53
INS 136 - 165 162

Lauric 15
Myristic 7
Palmitic 16
Stearic 7
Ricinoleic 0
Oleic 43
Linoleic 7
Linolenic 1
 
Re: Hmmm....

michael_schaap said:
Must be doing something wrong..... can't seem to find where it says how much Lye to use and how much water to use......oh wait.... the 3rd box... it must be asking me how much that I plan to use there and figure out the oils from what I have said.... be back :)
Click to expand...

You don't have to calculate the lye amount. Just leave those blank (but be sure to put your lye discount number) When you hit the view or print recipe button, you will see the lye calculation on that form.
 
michael_schaap said:
I'm finding out that Lard sucks!
Click to expand...

Hi Michael -

What is it about the Lard that dislike? I have a recipe that uses all of your ingredients with the exception that I add a bit of Castor Oil as well and I find it make a very nice, hard bar that lathers well despite the high % of Lard.

My recipe is:

50% Lard
30% Coconut
10% Olive
10% Castor (you can get this at any drug/grocery in the laxative section)
Lye Discount/Superfat 8%


I have noted here on the forum before that the Lard that I use (Armour brand - green/white packaging) smells very 'piggy' - like bacon grease. Others offered the opinion that it may be bad or rancid, but it is quite fresh and I have had the same smell from different batches at different stores. None of the piggy smell makes it through to the finished product.

Edit: And I'm seeing that NancyRogers gave you pretty much the same advice and almost identical recipe - I shoul dhave read through better before commenting!
 
Well I really can't give an opinion I suppose. Just when I replaced beef tallow with lard some of the numbers dropped very low.... still really figuring out what the numbers mean you know. Thank you for the recipe though!

Michael

P.S.
----
What do you think about the recipe that I posted? Good... bad..... ?
 
Beef Tallow

Well. It took all day to find but I found it. Right down the road from me too... go figure. I got five pounds and came home and cut it up to small pieces before tossing it in a pot. Added some water and just let it boil a bit. I used a potato masher in the end. Filled a few rubbermaid containers and now it's cooling. The end product looked something like ... hmmm... you know in the gardening section they got these pellets that you add to the dirt. The expand and absorb water so you dont have to water your plants as much. Thats what the end product looked like.

Am I in the ballpark for Tallow?

Michael
 
Re: Beef Tallow

michael_schaap said:
The end product looked something like ... hmmm... you know in the gardening section they got these pellets that you add to the dirt. The expand and absorb water so you dont have to water your plants as much. Thats what the end product looked like.

Am I in the ballpark for Tallow?

Michael
Click to expand...

You used animal fat?
I'd like to get pellets of tallow when i render :(
Could a veteran soaper/fat lover step up to this question please?
 
Well I REALLY used a potato masher here :) Kept thinking there might be more here. Not sure how to describe how much I got but it certainly looks enough for the batch. I wish I took pictures of my wife holding the strainer! She looked ready to pop :roll: It cooled down now and I put it in the fridge.

Michael
 
When I render beef tallow, I put about 5 lbs in a pot & totally cover with water and let it boil, boil, boil........and then boil some more, adding water as it evaporates. I probably cook it about 5 or 6 hours. Strain the contents of pan through cheesecloth and let it cool.

On day 2, I skim off the fat that has floated to the top & discard water (gunk) left in pan. Clean the pan and put the fat back in and again, cover it with water and bring it to a boil again. Boil for a couple of hours and then remove from heat and let it cool. After it has cooled, I place in the fridge.

On day 3, after setting in the fridge overnight, the fat is now one solid chunk that covers the surface of the pan. I break that up into big chunks and bag it. It does not resemble pellets at all, it's one solid sheet. I end up with about 2 lbs of clean tallow.
 
Oh yeah the Tallow does not look like pellets... its what was behind in the strainer that did. I figured that I got about 6 to 7 cups of Tallow in the 5 pounds that I got. Guessing I'll do better the next time I do it... probably do it like you just described. The book I'm following said it should be done in about 30 minutes and I gave it an hour. I think next time I'll boil the stuff left over in the stainer some more. I just looked at it now from the fridge and it looks like solid milk. The wife was like... wow... is that the same stuff :)



rubyslippers said:
When I render beef tallow, I put about 5 lbs in a pot & totally cover with water and let it boil, boil, boil........and then boil some more, adding water as it evaporates. I probably cook it about 5 or 6 hours. Strain the contents of pan through cheesecloth and let it cool.

On day 2, I skim off the fat that has floated to the top & discard water (gunk) left in pan. Clean the pan and put the fat back in and again, cover it with water and bring it to a boil again. Boil for a couple of hours and then remove from heat and let it cool. After it has cooled, I place in the fridge.

On day 3, after setting in the fridge overnight, the fat is now one solid chunk that covers the surface of the pan. I break that up into big chunks and bag it. It does not resemble pellets at all, it's one solid sheet. I end up with about 2 lbs of clean tallow.
Click to expand...
 
Using beef tallow

I don’t understand going through all the work of rendering Beef Tallow. It seems like such a mess, boiling, mashing, cooling, skimming etc. :( …when you can go to the store and buy lard for about a buck a pound. The numbers of both Lard and BT are pretty close looking at lye calc… :)
Hardness..Lard is 42, Beef T is 58. Bubbly and Cleansing ..both Lard and BT have small numbers plus conditioning and creamy are almost the same.
JS :wink:
 
Have you ever used unprocessed lard from a farm?
It's the most beautiful oil i've soaped with. Call me crazy but, it actually has a sweet (literally) aroma when the soap cures.
I suspect processed tallow(deodorized,refined,yada yada)would also be striped of many qualities like the processed lard. (i've never bought processed beef tallow so ymmv)

edit:being a noob soaper, i'm struggling to define what tallow adds to a bar. it just does :)
 
Farm soap...

I originally made soap from recipes that my mother, a farm girl, gave me many years ago. Lard was the ONLY oil that was used back in those days. That lard and beef tallow was rendered mostly from cooking and the like. So I guess it was unprocessed, whatever that means.

Of coarse, now soap making has been brought to a whole different level and the benefits of this are enjoyed by us all, in this modern age. :) I really can’t tell any difference using lard that I buy in the store now, from the stuff I used to use from home sources. I’m like everyone else now that makes handmade soap, adding a plethora of all different types of oils, scents and colorings which in my opinion masks any of the original fragrance and texture of soap made on the farm using just tallow and lard renderings.

Nice to here though that you’re enjoying the benefits of the old time recipes and I agree with you about the nice aroma of plain soap made from tallow and lard. That scent brings back a lot of memories. :D
Jerry S
You can take the boy off the farm, but you can't take the farm out of the boy... :wink:
 
Re: Farm soap...

Jerry S said:
I originally made soap from recipes that my mother, a farm girl, gave me many years ago. Lard was the ONLY oil that was used back in those days. That lard and beef tallow was rendered mostly from cooking and the like. So I guess it was unprocessed, whatever that means.

Of coarse, now soap making has been brought to a whole different level and the benefits of this are enjoyed by us all, in this modern age. :) I really can’t tell any difference using lard that I buy in the store now, from the stuff I used to use from home sources. I’m like everyone else now that makes handmade soap, adding a plethora of all different types of oils, scents and colorings which in my opinion masks any of the original fragrance and texture of soap made on the farm using just tallow and lard renderings.

Nice to here though that you’re enjoying the benefits of the old time recipes and I agree with you about the nice aroma of plain soap made from tallow and lard. That scent brings back a lot of memories. :D
Jerry S
You can take the boy off the farm, but you can't take the farm out of the boy... :wink:
Click to expand...

I'm a noob so my opinions about lard/tallow could change with time/experience.

I'm also sure the veteran soapers see greenhorns raving about this or that pretty often.
Preciate the comments.
 
I absolutely love my lard soaps. You're missing out big time if you don't try it. Can I suggest that you make small batches at first? :wink:
 

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