You get what you pay for!

Warning: serious vent :evil:

I just threw away some $50, not counting shipping costs, worth of "essential oils". Normally I get EO from Brambleberry, Soap Making Resources, and Majestic Mountain Sage, and never had a problem with them. The week before I was getting lye, tallow, etc. from xxx Depot and saw that they have some great prices for EO, so I ordered some. Just got done making a 4-lb batch of soap, and while blending the EOs, I noticed the lavadin and cedar both smell "chemical - y". The lavadin actually smelled more like some cheap FO. I went and check the bergamot, and cypress I bought, and they both smelled very artificial. So four bottles of 4oz. "EO" in the trash and an emergency trip to the local health food store to get some real cedar EO, I am cranky and tired. (As for the lavadin, I just used some expensive lavender I have on hand).

So the moral of the story is, if the prices of EO seem too good to be true, don't be tempted to go cheap!

I have gotten several of mine from WFMed it is a Ebay store and I have to say good prices and so far great product and they ship FAST I tend to have my order 2 days after I place it

Thank you, DragonQueen! I will check out that eBay store.

Sadly, most EOs are adulterated with various synthetic and natural components to both bring the price to a level the market will bear and to improve a poor oil so it can be sold. Most people will not know the difference between an EO that's been altered and stretched and one that hasn't. The suppliers of very high quality oils are enormously expensive, yet that reflects the true cost of an essential oil. Usually a lot more than the average consumer is willing to pay.

France exports more Lavender oil than it actually produces. That's because it's EO is being stretched and improved with synthetic components and other cheaper oils that are only detectable by an expert and gas chromatography. It's estimated that 90% of all essential oils sold are actually a melange of synthetic components and an essential oil, often altered at source before the distributors and retailers even see them. It's for this reason I don't fragrance my soap as even the more common EOs aren't what we think they are. :cry:

I do purchase high quality EOs for perfumery and even the price of a simple lavender will surprise you. These are oils that the retailer sources directly from a traditional distiller. The distillery gets a higher price for their product and an incentive to maintain it's quality, rather than having their products auctioned off to market dominators who's main objective is to sell a lot of oil at a lower price point. One has to wonder what a realistic price is for a substance that is difficult and costly to produce and consumes vast amounts of plant material in it's manufacture. Most essential oils of undiluted quality are too expensive to buy in sizes larger than a 1/2 Oz.

Sometimes this extending is as simple as mixing a higher quality EO with a cheaper but similar smelling EO of another plant. That does change the scent profile somewhat which is then rectified by adding the notes which are now 'off' synthetically. Rosemary oil is routinely extended with eucalyptus, they smell similar in the top note but the drydown is different. Ever bought a rosemary EO that you thought for sure was eucalyptus? Now you know why. Other times a poorly produced oil, lets say lemon is recitified by having synthetic citral added to it, to make it more lemony and what the consumer expects. Therefore more marketable.

The reality is that we are now so accustomed to synthetic versions of scents that we do not have an acute understanding of what the real thing smells like. Coconut is a really good example of this. That scent we all recognise as coconut doesn't smell much like natural coconut odour which I find to be quite nauseating. We've been conditioned to a version of it which has copious amounts of coumarin added in order to make it more palatable to people. I've never come across an apple that smells anything like synthetic apple fragrance which has been constructed to trigger our brain receptors to think 'apple' when we smell it. I'm actually really fascinated with the overt conditioning of our sense of smell by cosmetic and food manufacturers. The brain can be tricked easily with certain chemicals, some of them have no odour in and of themselves but they trigger a certain memory response in the brain so that we think we are smelling a certain thing.

Thank you, ClaraSuds for your insightful explanation!

As much as I want to try using FOs in soap making, they simply don't smell "right" to me. Nor the cheap so-called-EOs. And I have not got the point that I can be happy with unscented soap. Which is why I try to use a cheaper version of the real thing, i.e., lavadin instead of lavender. Perhaps I have to accept a certain percentage of synthetics in the EOs, as long as it is low enough that I cannot detect it with my nose!

The alternative is maybe going back to making the very first soap I made: milk chocolate soap. The scent came from using an insanely high percentage of unrefined, organic, food grade cacao butter and organic cacao powder.

Wow! Those soaps look great. I want some! :shock:

Yeah it's a depressing realisation about the eo industry and honestly we are more likely to come into contact with numerous unwanted synthetics just standing in an elevator. It's not like we can avoid synthetics since most people waft around in a cloud of them daily. Not all synthetics are harmful either. I initially wanted to create all natural perfumes, believing that all but the cheapest eo's were pure and that it was an easy goal to achieve. The discovery that even with the best intentions and paying high prices you still cannot absolutely guarantee purity was a shocking and depressing blow to my ideals. :cry: Yet, the next realisation that came was that even the very food we eat and anything packaged in plastic is laced with synthentic fragrance anyway. It's impossible to avoid them and strangely that made me relax about the whole issue. I still aim to create perfumes from natural sources but I cannot guarantee what I create won't have a dash of such and such here and there. My main interest in natural perfumery is to discover what perfume actually smelt like before ISO E Super took over cosmetics counters everywhere. I'd like to know what real perfume used to be like.

Tangent - I watched this great documentary about food flavouring and the fact that McDonalds food tastes identical the world over has nothing to do with the actual food. They've had someone create the flavour of McDonalds in a lab. :shock:

Anyway, the ones to watch out for are synthetic musks. They don't actually biodegrade and have been shown to cause hormonal disruption in the human body. A dash of synthetic lavender compounds in your lavandin isn't going to do you much harm and you will get a bigger hit of that walking the laundry aisle of your supermarket. I knew with soap my choice was go synthetic or go fragrance free. I made the decision to scent my leave-on body products with high grade eo's and enjoy their aroma that way as it's more affordable. The soaping experience I can handle fragrance free.

For anyone that's interested here's an article on adulteration of eo's.

http://www.naha.org/articles/adulteration_1.htm

Thanks for the heads up about synthetic musks! I will do my best to avoid them.

I spent my childhood outside of the US. When you say real perfume, it brings back memory of the of real sandalwood incense in the temples of China and India (back when they still had and used the real stuff), the rose attar and musk on the Arabs I went to school with, and the jasmine and other flowers (that I have no idea what their English names are) sold in the markets in Asia. I also remember buying chunks of sandalwood and some unknown resins and placed them in my dresser. Unfortunately most North Americans seem to prefer the lighter, fruitier, aldehyde-type scents as indicated by the commercial perfume market.

Tangent - I watched this great documentary about food flavouring and the fact that McDonalds food tastes identical the world over has nothing to do with the actual food. They've had someone create the flavour of McDonalds in a lab.

Click to expand...

Maybe that's why I can detect some of the synthetics when used in higher percentage in the "EOs". I have a very sensitive nose (some friends joke about me being part dog!) and most likely due to not flooding my surroundings, especially food, with artificial flavorings as I hate fast food, make most things from scratch, and try to get most food items at the least adulterated state from farmers I know.

It is not that I am such a snob that I won't use FOs. They simply don't smell right to me.

I think the direction I should take is: avoid stuff that are actually harmful (such as synthetic musks, FO with phthalates, etc.), and then just "go with the nose".

You sound like a kindred spirit... :wink: I've a big interest in real scents and also arab perfumery. It sucks when our time and money is wasted on products that are not as they are represented to be. I recently bought some high grade natural resin incense from a supplier who then charged me the entire cost of the product again (over $30!) to ship an item which would easily fit in a small letter envelope. When I queried that I got a ' sorry its not my problem what the post office charge' email in reply. So disappointing. Not because of the money but because I thought I'd finally found a great supplier of something I really wanted but it wasn't to be. :evil:

I have gotten excellent quality EOs for what I consider to be reasonable prices from New Directions Aromatics, Liberty Natural, Brambleberry, Camden Grey, The Scent Works (FCC grade), and Essential Oil University (now the Perfumery). I have no reason to believe that they have been adulterated or cut. Obviously real sandalwood and rose otto will set you back, but I have found many basic EOs that aren't meaningfully more expensive than FOs per weight. Within my budget there is a bewildering array of choices if you are interested in experimenting with blends.

I have good experience with Brambleberry. The prices are reasonable and the quality is consistent. And since I am using EOs more for scent and less for therapeutic purposes, I am OK with that.

Not so happy with Camden Grey as I had some bergamot that smell "salty". The ones I threw away from XXX Depot , I swear I can smell synthetics in them.

I have seen complaints on the internet about quality from Camden Grey but in my experience, everything I've purchased from them has smelled as it should.

So sorry to hear that. I used to purchase from a supplier when I was new and didn't realize until I purchased from another supplier that these EO's were a lot weaker.
So I figured they must have been diluted hence why they were cheaper then everyone else. It is frustrating for sure.

Hope your soap turns out well.

Although I have not yet ordered any lavender essential oil from the following, I'm sure it's authentic and have heard wonderful things about them ... they are not too far from me so I should go there one day! It's called Imagine Lavender and I believe the site address is http://www.imaginelavender.com ... I didn't look up my notes before posting, however. Just thought I would offer this anyway, as I'm sure this is authentic U.S. grown lavender essential oil.

Kathy

P.S. Sorry to hear about your purchase ... we've all done it at some point, some of us, even to tears. We only have so much in our scent budget, and those decisions we make are so vital, and when we find that we've made the wrong choice, it's always frustrating. But, it's all part of finding where the good suppliers and scents are and often leads us to better things and purchasing plans. If I were you, I would find alternative sources for the other products you purchased from this company as well. That will make you feel better too.

Kathy, thank you very much for the link!

I will definitely check out other products from this site. Sometimes it is a matter of priority. I am OK with cutting corners in other areas to make my budget work but I do not begrudge paying a little bit more for things I put inside (i.e. food) or outside my body (soap, skincare products) to minimize exposure to questionable chemicals. It also makes me feel good to know that the products are from some countries (US, western Europe, etc.) that workers are for the most part treated fairly.

Seifenblasen said:

Warning: serious vent :evil:


So the moral of the story is, if the prices of EO seem too good to be true, don't be tempted to go cheap!

Click to expand...

I've also been tempted by the cheapies...but I've learned my lesson! Thanks for the reminder!

That's it, EO or bust! :twisted:

In the last month I have made two batches of CP using FO that everyone raves about: Nature's Garden's Crackling Birch and Brambleberry's Spiced Mahogany. I SO wanted to like them, because of the lower cost and simplicity (somebody already did the blending for me), but they just don't smell right.

Another lesson learned. Back to EO only. And if I cannot afford expensive EOs, use cheaper ones like peppermint or what not. Or go scent-free.

Peppermint may be more cost effective it is also one most everyone likes I have found

Something just to think about. Once you start selling (or if you are already selling) people love FO's and even if you personally don't like them (I make soaps with scents I don't like) your customers do. I love EO's but I also know I need to increase my price for soaps that are scented with them and my customers have come to understand that too.

I just wanted to throw that out there.... :wink:

Lindy, thanks for the tip!

I am not selling nor have any plans to sell, especially after reading Tabitha's post. :shock: I barter a little bit with some friends and co-workers. I don't have a yard to grow things so I give them soap they give me buckets of raspberries, bunches of lavender, etc.

But, perhaps I could keep the EO soaps to myself and pawn the FO soaps to them!

Thank you again!

I prefer unscented to most FOs. I love EO blends!

I do sell soap, and I use FOs mostly in response to customer demand. Folks ask me for coconut, lilac, rose, fruits, scents that are either too expensive as EOs, or just don't exist. So I use some FOs. I do not mind the scent from a distance, as they cure in my house. When I sniff them close some of them smell too strong to me though!

So I do not dislike them, I just would not choose them to bathe with. I rather do all EO, or simply unscented. The exception might be vanilla. I really like the vanilla FO I got, and I would consider bathing with a soap scented with vanilla.