Why make soap?

I been doing a lot of reading and comparing answers from all over and it leaves me a bit confused. So, I figured I would just spit it all out and ask the questions. These are the words from a new soaper who reads a lot and has much interest in making a good soap.
No disrespect to the hobby, but my questions are a bit more straight forward and to the point.
I'm already addicted to soap making and accurate knowledge is very important to me.

If you might be having a reaction to a specific type of oil, couldn't you just wipe a whole bunch of CO on 1 hand and PO on the other and let it sit for hour and see what happens? Or allergic reactions only happen if that oil is Soponified?
Making test batches, waiting for cure times, recalculating and making another adjustment until you get what you want. It would take 20 years to maybe come up with a ok bar of soap, especially when someone suggests upping or lowering 1% with each test batch..
And with all the variables water conditions, skin types, elevations, season, diet, and the moon phases. What is the purpose of home made SOAP? Spend hundreds of $$$ and so many years instead of just buying soap from the store which I have never had a problem with on any brand and type I have tried. I have interest in making a better soap, wow soap, the best you ever used soap.

This is a serious question. I just spent $300 to get started in soap making, so I have real interest in it, but these are some of the questions I have in the whole soap making process from all the post I have read.
Then when a number is said to be too high and a simple recipe is given for help that has a number much higher then what was said to be too high, I don't get it..
Or when I hear no soap is never conditioning, it's only cleansing. What is the purpose of adding a bunch of stuff to make it conditioning?
All the info I read all over everywhere, not much of it connects..

PatrickH said:

I been doing a lot of reading and comparing answers from all over and it leaves me a bit confused. So, I figured I would just spit it all out and ask the questions. These are the words from a new soaper who reads a lot and has much interest in making a good soap.
No disrespect to the hobby, but my questions are a bit more straight forward and to the point.
I'm already addicted to soap making and accurate knowledge is very important to me.

If you might be having a reaction to a specific type of oil, couldn't you just wipe a whole bunch of CO on 1 hand and PO on the other and let it sit for hour and see what happens? Or allergic reactions only happen if that oil is Soponified?

Click to expand...

Yes, you can test allergy to oils by testing it on your skin. If you think you are allergic to a particular oil, you need to do this before soaping with it.

PatrickH said:

Making test batches, waiting for cure times, recalculating and making another adjustment until you get what you want. It would take 20 years to maybe come up with a ok bar of soap, especially when someone suggests upping or lowering 1% with each test batch..

Click to expand...

I would never suggest someone change a recipe by 1% unless we were referring to beeswax, lanolin, or pine tar. Most base oils I would change no less than 5% at the time.

PatrickH said:

And with all the variables water conditions, skin types, elevations, season, diet, and the moon phases. What is the purpose of home made SOAP? Spend hundreds of $$$ and so many years instead of just buying soap from the store which I have never had a problem with on any brand and type I have tried. I have interest in making a better soap, wow soap, the best you ever used soap.

Click to expand...

I was having eczema with every soap the dermatologist told me to try. I HAD to change something. My change was making soap at home. And that was the end of the eczema. I still get it on my hands occasionally if I use dish detergent or cleaners without gloves, but no more on my body. Other people may have other reasons, but that is mine.

PatrickH said:

This is a serious question. I just spent $300 to get started in soap making, so I have real interest in it, but these are some of the questions I have in the whole soap making process from all the post I have read.
Then when a number is said to be to high and a simple recipe is given that has a number much higher then what was said to be too high, I don't get it..
All the info I read all over everywhere, not much of it connects..

Click to expand...

I understand that. I strongly suggest you try a few of the recipes given on this forum, and form your own opinions. I can't tolerate high CO, your skin might be able to. Every recipe needs to be tried by you, so that you can see what YOU like. Just run them by us first before trying to avoid wasting ingredients. Even if we don't like it for ourselves, we will tell you if it will work or not.

PatrickH said:

I'm already addicted to soap making

Click to expand...

^^^That right there
I love using nice soap. Probably the main reason I make soap is because I love making it. I love giving it to friends and family. I love that I can make it smell just how I want it to. I love that there is always something new to try. I love that it challenges me. I love the creative aspect. All of it. This is why I make more soap that DH and I can use up in a lifetime. It never gets old.

When you are creating a recipe and post it here, you will always get a lot of advice. This is usually based on the person's own experience with a particular oil - most often coconut. Someone with dry skin will advise you to stay at or under 15%. My skin will tolerate 25% with no problem and I love fluffy, bubbly lather. Usually I use somewhere between 20-23%. You will find what you like best in time. Start simple. It might not seem that simple will give you the 'best' soap you can make, but it really can. Have fun and enjoy the ride.

I make soap to preserve my sanity. Love having a relaxing project that I can always learn a little more about and improve on. Cutting into a fresh block of soap is like christmas morning :smalltree:

Your first batches will be nice enough with a good cure - 4 weeks to a year Start adjusting by 10% til you get the hang of it. You'll soon get a feel for what those changes bring to soap, and you can adjust one oil by 5%, another by 3% or 20%. Play around with superfat. Add a few wacky ingredients. Love how different recipes feel.... a silky soap, a cushiony soap, stiff peaks, fat round bubbles, light milky froth ... In a year you'll make the best soap ever. A year after that you'll really make the best soap ever. A year after that you'll make the soap of all soaps.... I hope Oh and don't forget to play with designs and develop a lust for scents on the way.

Why do you make soap yourself? That really is the question.

Totally makes sense.
A lot of my reading and a bit of common sense points me in the direction of everything you said. It totally throws me off when I read at places where it says something totally different, then it makes me feel like I'm not understanding a specific something with what I thought I did understand.
Thank you for clearing up a few subjects for me. I'm a perfectionist and accurate details matter a lot to me along with liking everything custom
I Also don't have a lot of patients and realize there is no way around it really with soap making. I started with HP after reading at many places it's ready to use within 2 weeks, but then after making a few batches, I'm now seeing people say that it takes the same or longer to cure then CP.. :-? So now I'm kinda confused on the purpose of HP besides being able to add SF after the cook, which is probably best for use in Shaving soap and not so much hand and body soap.

Good responses here.
I like things that are custom. Tying flies, building fishing rods and other things here and there. I was going to make knives, but the cost is way to expensive right now to start.
I then discovered soap making and it looked very interesting. I purchased a good artisan bar soap and it was great. I tried artisan shave soap and it was great, tried a more expensive one and mind blown! With this many differences and the shaving irritation on my neck I always had was almost totally gone, I wanted to see what I could do with making my own and making it possibly better. So then the journey begins.
And I didn't wanna spend a bunch every time I wanted to buy a bar or more shaving soap, even though I spend $300 in equipment and ingrediants just to get me started lol..
My favorite calming part for me is weighting out all the ingrediants.

And then comes the dreaded step of adding lye to water, the worst part of soapmaking for me.. gives me a headache all day the next day, even when mixed outside head down and away and slwcooker by a open door..

PatrickH said:

And I didn't wanna spend a bunch every time I wanted to buy a bar or more shaving soap, even though I spend $300 in equipment and ingrediants just to get me started lol..

Click to expand...

Lol that sounds familiar :mrgreen:

PatrickH said:

And then comes the dreaded step of adding lye to water, the worst part of soapmaking for me.. gives me a headache all day the next day, even when mixed outside head down and away and slwcooker by a open door..

Click to expand...

I don't have any experience with HP but if you tell us a bit more about your process others can help troubleshoot - no need for headaches. My first thought is fragrance with phthalates can be a problem for some people.

HP is a great way to use FOs that are notorious for cause issues or not really sticking. It's not a waste of time. You can get around the longer cure time by using lower heat and less water but that takes practice and trial-and-error. I personally make soap because I like it better than what I used to buy but I can gaurantee you that I shelled out way less than $300 on my supplies when I started. No offense but what in the world did you get?

I first wanted to make soap because it was something I remember doing with my grandma as a child.

I found this place and learned about different oils, recipes, colors and scents.

I went a little crazy that first year. Tried fancy designs, expensive butters and oils, ordered way too many scents.

Easily spent over $2000 in that year experimenting, looking for that perfect recipe for me.

Ended up making a lot of pretty soap that was garbage. Too many additives, bad recipes, awful scents. Ended up throwing a lot away.

Family wasn't using what I gifted, soaps went rancid. Finally settled on two basic recipes, one very simple lard based with no fancy oils and a high coconut salt bar.

I also refined my scents to more simple familiar smells and stopped with the bright over colored soaps. Now family use what I make and frequently order speciality scents for holidays. One aunt will only use my salt bars, I send her a big box twice a year.

I guess for me, it's the satisfaction of knowing I made this and being able to control what goes on my skin. My skin is better on handmade soap and I really enjoy making it.

Trying to save money was never a motive to me. Soaping is a hobby and hobbies can be expensive. It's not bad now that I have all the experimenting done and only make soap when I need to.

Arimara said:

I personally make soap because I like it better than what I used to buy but I can gaurantee you that I shelled out way less than $300 on my supplies when I started. No offense but what in the world did you get?

Click to expand...

Just a few things and a couple other things not shown in pictures.

PatrickH said:

Just a few things and a couple other things not shown in pictures.

Click to expand...

All of that is fine except:

1. the pitchers are extremely risky as they can shatter while soap making. Types 2 and 5 plastic containers are a much safer choice and a whole lot cheaper too.

2. That stick blender is fine for now but you may want to invest in a SB with a detachable attachment. It makes for easier cleaning (safer too).

Other than that, it looks like you got a bit over-zealous. You'll use it up as you go. Just keep some notes on how each recipe you try feels and you will do fine. But, do follow some advice as well. I almost got around to making a soap with 25% castor oil at one point. I'm glad I found out that soap with >5% castor oil is not liked by my skin.

PatrickH said:

This is a serious question. I just spent $300 to get started in soap making, so I have real interest in it, but these are some of the questions I have in the whole soap making process from all the post I have read.
Then when a number is said to be too high and a simple recipe is given for help that has a number much higher then what was said to be too high, I don't get it..
Or when I hear no soap is never conditioning, it's only cleansing. What is the purpose of adding a bunch of stuff to make it conditioning?
All the info I read all over everywhere, not much of it connects..

Click to expand...

Remember, anyone with an internet connection can call themselves an expert in anything with no proof to back it up. Soap is also one of those everyday items that people trust to work without doing the scientific research to back it up. There's a reason people keep pointing to Kevin Dunn's work, he's one of the few people to apply actual science to soap making for more than a demonstration that it can be done. From my memory there are a few papers around here and there, some guy in the 1920's (I don't remember his name but he's where we got INS numbers), and Kevin Dunn. Everything else is subjective by definition (in that it's not lab settings with repeatable conditions).

Forcing myself back into a direct topic. You might be at that time in every soaper's life where you start playing with sing oil soaps. Just that proof to yourself why 100% castor oil doesn't work too well or what straight coconut oil will do to your skin. Pick your oil selection, 5% SF, and dive in. You'll find your personal definition of cleansing vs stripping, conditioning vs unsopanificables, hardness vs what point in cure time did the origin person measure it, the actual difference between creamy and bubbly and how to make a bar that has both

ahhh love the pictures. You are all settled!

In my case I love luxury soaps. I used to go to either Macy's or Ross (lol) to find the good ones. Then I found out when I was watching a craft video, someone came up making soap from scratch. I was going to buy from etsy, and then I went Ugh? That is a lot for 1 bar, so I decided to make mine, and I was hooked.

I did MP as a craft for a long time, and we sued them occasionally. After the video, I started making HP. When I got here I started going crazy making CP, because of the design element.

I am a very creative person, for me is kind of a creative outlet.

I think I have found my notch. I love my soaps, I think they are wonderful on the skin, I am lucky I am not allergic to anything in particular. Now that I have tried a gazillion recipes. I have only 2, I like and use. Unless is like the challenge or something.

I got into making soap because I'm a maker, and it looked interesting, and I love learning new skills.

I like doing creative projects that leave me with something I can hand someone and say "Isn't this neat? Want it?" I've currently got at least two people that are already going to be giving me enthusiastic "Yes!"'s anytime I offer them soap. I also have a wide DIY streak in me. I want to be able to make as many of the things that I use on a daily basis as I can. That's a big part of what led me into cooking and baking as well. And soapmaking and cooking aren't that far apart in what you're doing. They're both a kind of alchemy, involving esoteric materials and reactions. Just, one result you can eat, the other you can wash the bbq sauce off with. Try not to mix them up.

One money saving tip: you can find a lot of the oils you need at the grocery store - just make sure they're fresh.

Many of us swear by Armor-brand lard at Walmart. Many of us also use Cristco animal-fat shortening, it's a combo of palm and tallow.

If you have a bulk store like Costco nearby, that's a great place to stock up on oils and fats. Olive oil, avocado oil, coconut oil, etc. All easily found at grocery stores and usually a lot cheaper than Brambleberry.

And when you're ready to take the leap into larger quantities, Soapers Choice is a great option.

---

As for recipe formulation, I started with a highly recommended one here on the forum and only changed a few things to come up with a lovely base recipe that I use for almost everything. The only thing I switch up are colours, fragrances and additives.

PatrickH said:

Totally makes sense.
A lot of my reading and a bit of common sense points me in the direction of everything you said. It totally throws me off when I read at places where it says something totally different, then it makes me feel like I'm not understanding a specific something with what I thought I did understand.
Thank you for clearing up a few subjects for me. I'm a perfectionist and accurate details matter a lot to me along with liking everything custom
I Also don't have a lot of patients and realize there is no way around it really with soap making. I started with HP after reading at many places it's ready to use within 2 weeks, but then after making a few batches, I'm now seeing people say that it takes the same or longer to cure then CP.. :-? So now I'm kinda confused on the purpose of HP besides being able to add SF after the cook, which is probably best for use in Shaving soap and not so much hand and body soap.

Good responses here.
I like things that are custom. Tying flies, building fishing rods and other things here and there. I was going to make knives, but the cost is way to expensive right now to start.
I then discovered soap making and it looked very interesting. I purchased a good artisan bar soap and it was great. I tried artisan shave soap and it was great, tried a more expensive one and mind blown! With this many differences and the shaving irritation on my neck I always had was almost totally gone, I wanted to see what I could do with making my own and making it possibly better. So then the journey begins.
And I didn't wanna spend a bunch every time I wanted to buy a bar or more shaving soap, even though I spend $300 in equipment and ingrediants just to get me started lol..
My favorite calming part for me is weighting out all the ingrediants.

And then comes the dreaded step of adding lye to water, the worst part of soapmaking for me.. gives me a headache all day the next day, even when mixed outside head down and away and slwcooker by a open door..

Click to expand...

I always wear a mask when mixing lye and water--even when I do this step outdoors.

I just want to say, be careful what you're reading online. There is A LOT of bad information out there, some even dangerous. This place is THE best source on the 'Net by very, very far.

Arimara said:

All of that is fine except:

1. the pitchers are extremely risky as they can shatter while soap making. Types 2 and 5 plastic containers are a much safer choice and a whole lot cheaper too.

2. That stick blender is fine for now but you may want to invest in a SB with a detachable attachment. It makes for easier cleaning (safer too).

Other than that, it looks like you got a bit over-zealous. You'll use it up as you go. Just keep some notes on how each recipe you try feels and you will do fine. But, do follow some advice as well. I almost got around to making a soap with 25% castor oil at one point. I'm glad I found out that soap with >5% castor oil is not liked by my skin.

Click to expand...

^^This, and be sure to line that metal rack before you put soap on it! You don't want DOS from the metal!

I got into making soap that transitioned from making bath bombs. My 16yr niece loves LUSH and I was appalled at spending $7-$9 per bath bomb and thought, "Hey, I saw this somewhere...I can learn how to do this myself!" and the rest is history.

After I started, I really learned to appreciate the quality of what you make yourself versus what is bought over-the-counter. For example, I've been preserving and canning for years, so I already knew and appreciated the quality of homemade jams, jellies, salsa, etc. versus store-bought. They're healthier, taste better, and are 1000% better in quality...same with soap.

There's also the science/creative aspect to it all, as I'm sort of a science nerd and love to learn these sort of things. For some reason, I love the journey of REALLY learning something new through trial-and-error. Yeah, you are not going to make "the most perfect soap in the world" in a few months, but to me that's part of the fun! I also feel these home craft arts (homesteading) are lost over time and feel that it's really important (and neat) to preserve them.

If you might be having a reaction to a specific type of oil, couldn't you just wipe a whole bunch of CO on 1 hand and PO on the other and let it sit for hour and see what happens? Or allergic reactions only happen if that oil is Soponified?

Click to expand...

I would love to discover this with an allergist with a chemistry background (or maybe a chemist with an allergist background. When saponified, the oil becomes a new chemical. Coconut oil is very different from sodium cocoate. So I would assume it would be possible for some people to be allergic to coconut oil and not sodium cocoate, depending on what part of the coconut oil they are allergic too. For example, some people are allergic to the proteins in peanuts, so properly extracted peanut oil (protein free), is safe for them. But since nobody is measuring the protein content of peanut oil, they avoid all peanut oil just to be safe. (This is my understanding, I could be totally wrong.) Shea butter is much higher in unsaponifiables (components that do not become soap), than many other oils (such as coconut oil). So a shea butter soap has a lot more in common with shea butter, chemically speaking.

If you are a person with a known allergy, it's probably better to have a professional allergy test done, rather than just putting oils on yourself.

Making test batches, waiting for cure times, recalculating and making another adjustment until you get what you want. It would take 20 years to maybe come up with a ok bar of soap, especially when someone suggests upping or lowering 1% with each test batch.

Click to expand...

Generally speaking, we tend to recommend adjusting in 5% or 10% increments. But unless you have extremely sensitive skin, you probably aren't going to go from 'meh' to 'WOW' with a 5% adjustment.

And with all the variables water conditions, skin types, elevations, season, diet, and the moon phases. What is the purpose of home made SOAP? Spend hundreds of $$$ and so many years instead of just buying soap from the store which I have never had a problem with on any brand and type I have tried. I have interest in making a better soap, wow soap, the best you ever used soap.

Click to expand...

The purpose of homemade soap will vary from soaper to soaper. I think it is very soul-nourishing for us, as creative beings, to make from scratch some of the things we use. You could argue that the bread from the store is great - why waste time reading about bread making from scratch, experimenting with techniques, etc? I think nourishes the soul to eat bread you make from scratch, or use soap you make from scratch, or wear a sweater you crocheted/knitted, etc.

Some people have more concrete reasons. As an example, many items that are advertised as "fragrance free" do in fact contain fragrance. So some people with very bad allergies/sensitivities make their own products from scratch so they can guarantee exactly what is in it.

Then when a number is said to be too high and a simple recipe is given for help that has a number much higher then what was said to be too high, I don't get it.

Click to expand...

The numbers are guidelines. It might help if you gave a specific example to see why somebody went against the guidelines. It could also just be that person's experience with that recipe worked for them. There are folks here with excema who use no coconut oil at all b/c they've found it irritates that condition - and folks here with excema that use high coconut oil soap b/c they like it.

Or when I hear no soap is never conditioning, it's only cleansing. What is the purpose of adding a bunch of stuff to make it conditioning?

Click to expand...

It's true that soap is a rinse-off product, so it's not going to moisturize your skin. The purpose of conditioning oils is to make it less drying. Also, with oils like avocado and shea butter, they have a lot of unsaponifiables, so I think some of those could be left behind on your skin to moisturize. When people say "I want a moisturizing soap" we tend to leap into "soap doesn't moisturize" because if you have very dry skin, you may need a very mild soap AND a good lotion. No soap - even if you made soap with 100% shea butter and 20% superfat - is going to moisturize like a good lotion.

All the info I read all over everywhere, not much of it connects.

Click to expand...

Context is key. There are very very few absolutes in soap making. As you learn more, you will start to build a frame work of information and will start to see how things fit together.

Another thought - as if I'm not wordy enough!

You can also use the example of nutrition. For example, drinking a glass of wine every day can decrease your risk of heart disease - but it can increase your risk of dementia. So (from a health standpoint) are you more at risk for heart disease or dementia? If your family history is mostly people dying at 65 or 70 in sound mind, maybe try that glass of wine a day. But if your family history is people living to 90 but suffering impaired judgment at 70, then maybe don't drink wine every day.

Those are only two factors. Depression? Alcohol is a depressant. Diabetes? Wine and beer are high in sugar, but whiskey is okay.