Sharon Johnson HP method?

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I think the time to cook is fairly dependent on recipe and crockpot. Older crockpots tend to cook at lower temperatures - which would extend the overall cook time. I have a small, new crockpot that cooks my HP in around 30ish minutes. I only cook mine until there is no zap.

Disclaimer: I'm a CP soaper most of the time and have limited HP experience. Hopefully folks with more HP will chime in with their experiences. :)
 
I think the time to cook is fairly dependent on recipe and crockpot. Older crockpots tend to cook at lower temperatures - which would extend the overall cook time. I have a small, new crockpot that cooks my HP in around 30ish minutes. I only cook mine until there is no zap.

Disclaimer: I'm a CP soaper most of the time and have limited HP experience. Hopefully folks with more HP will chime in with their experiences. :)

Thanks. That issue always bugged me :)
 
I have to ask, whenever I did hot process I learned that as soon as there was no zap to finish with the additives and mold it asap so as not to overcook my soap. Thing is none my soap ever made it past 30 minutes to no zap. So I always molded as soon as I didn't have a zap. But, when I would continue to read about HP methods I was still seeing an hour cook time in many tutorials. My question is, do you continue to cook past saponification or does your recipe take an hour to no zap? The couple of times I did continue to cook longer my soap dried out. Maybe I missing something?
I think its due to the fact that very old recipes cooked for a very long time (because they didnt have the advantages we do with knowing sap values and pure lyes), and its also one of those basically wrong things people perpetuate like "mix shredded soap with water to make easy liquid soap" or "HP soap doesn't need a cure".
 
I think its due to the fact that very old recipes cooked for a very long time (because they didnt have the advantages we do with knowing sap values and pure lyes), and its also one of those basically wrong things people perpetuate like "mix shredded soap with water to make easy liquid soap" or "HP soap doesn't need a cure".
That makes sense, I'm really glad I have a year of HP making, I'm sure I will return to it many times. But I do love CP, thanks for your input.
 
Okay, I checked it out....it's not a new method. It's an old method which I tried years ago. I abandoned this method because I wanted to not have to replace my stick blender at the cost of an additional $30.00. I don't mind cooking the soap in a crock pot for a total of around 60 minutes until it is totally cured.
Her minions will demand you prove that this is an old method. Because none of them have been soaping longer than a year, have learned everything they know from a Facebook group, and seem to be like little children who think life began when they did ;)
 
Ok, so I've been using this method almost exclusively for the last six months. That said, I've been tweaking and adjusting along the way, so by now I'm not following Sharon Johnson's instructions all that closely.

I've not tried it again but I have a theory that you don't need to SB it the whole time. I really would like to try it again at around 250 F. I think you need to SB it to thick trace, then stir it continually.

You're on to something here! I get much better results when I heat the oils to about 235 F, and I stop stick blending well before the volcano. At this point I'm stick blending less than 60 seconds. When it starts to look "right" -- maybe 45 seconds of stick blending, on LOW -- I stop, cover the pot with a clear lid, and watch for the volcano, which shows up within a minute usually. Don't walk away from it, you need to act fast to stir it down so it doesn't boil over onto your counter. (I had that experience once, it was interesting! No damage, thanks to safety gear, etc.)

I use sodium lactate at 3% of the oil weight, and I've never found that it does anything weird to the texture or firmness of the soap. After 3-ish weeks of curing they're just as hard as my cured CP, but I like a hard recipe with a lot of stearic acid, so that could be a factor. I haven't done this with a softer recipe.

It would be interesting if one of you doing this method tests the shrinkage of these soaps over time - like over at least six months, preferably a year. See if they shrink, warp, etc.

I second what Reinbeau said. I often see bars that are newly made with this type of method that look fantastic, but I've yet to see a any pics of the bars 6 months to a year later. It would be very helpful to see how they fare in the shrinkage department.

IrishLass :)

I can't speak for others, but mine DO shrink/warp in typical HP fashion. My first "stick blend" HP bars are 6 months old now. They don't seem to shrink/warp as MUCH as bars made with other HP methods, but I'm not going to pretend that it doesn't happen at all. It drives me up the wall when people are not truthful about this stuff.

I've spent the last year trying to solve the warping issue, and it's possible that there simply isn't a solution, but I'm not ready to accept defeat quite yet.

I also don't do this with the "standard" 38% water as % of oils. I use about a 30% lye concentration, which in my recipes is usually about 32% water as % of oils.

Okay, I checked it out....it's not a new method. It's an old method which I tried years ago. I abandoned this method because I wanted to not have to replace my stick blender at the cost of an additional $30.00. I don't mind cooking the soap in a crock pot for a total of around 60 minutes until it is totally cured.

Really? This surprises me; for some reason I didn't think people were using stick blenders to make soap until about 10 years ago, but what I don't know would fill several libraries. My stick blender's doing just fine, but like I mentioned above, I don't actually run it for more than a minute. I use a 200 watt Cuisinart and it's quite the little workhorse.

Her minions will demand you prove that this is an old method. Because none of them have been soaping longer than a year, have learned everything they know from a Facebook group, and seem to be like little children who think life began when they did ;)

Yeah, Facebook soaping groups can be pretty obnoxious like that. I don't think it's fair to single out any one group, though, since those attitudes seem pretty universal on Facebook. I don't follow them very much, but every once in a while you come across a little gem that turns out to be quite helpful.

I will say that I've been troubled by the viciousness I've seen directed at Sharon Johnson, particularly on Facebook. People are entitled to their opinions, and they're entitled to disagree, but there's no reason to be nasty about it. I imagine she's enthusiastic about the way she makes soap and she wants to share that. How is that a bad thing?

I suppose one could argue that she's endorsing this idea that you can/should sell your soap just a few days after it's made, but that's hardly an original thought. "Instant cure!" nonsense is all over the place.

I'm also not sure why people are so outraged by her selling a book about the method. There are lots of soapmaking books out there. Why is this any different?
 
I got a chuckle out of the term "old recipes" and "old crockpots". The time hp soap takes to cook varies. A small crock pot produces a small batch of soap, therefore, it may not take an hour to cook.
Another factor to consider in hp soap making is the oils and additives that are used.
All in all, boys and girls, the soap is done when it is done.
Photo: Pink Himalayan Salt HP Soap
The difference that the method is not new and some people feel that they have been deceived and wasted their money

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I've seen lots of drama on YouTube regarding SJ and her method. Since she claims to have invented the method (and I vaguely recall some talk of patents or trademarks pending), people that posted videos of themselves making soap this way were bombarded with comments from SJ's followers, demanding that credit be given to SJ as the creator of the method and that it be referred to as SJHP (Sharon Johnson Hot Process) instead of SBHP (Stick Blend Hot Process). This is probably why there's been such a backlash against her.
 
I will say that I've been troubled by the viciousness I've seen directed at Sharon Johnson, particularly on Facebook. People are entitled to their opinions, and they're entitled to disagree, but there's no reason to be nasty about it. I imagine she's enthusiastic about the way she makes soap and she wants to share that. How is that a bad thing?

I suppose one could argue that she's endorsing this idea that you can/should sell your soap just a few days after it's made, but that's hardly an original thought. "Instant cure!" nonsense is all over the place.

I'm also not sure why people are so outraged by her selling a book about the method. There are lots of soapmaking books out there. Why is this any different?
Thank you for your good review of your thoughts on this method.

You don't understand the 'viciousness' - it's because of her own words and actions. It's her insistence that it's her method - which is utter crap. Nothing she's done is anything new or revolutionary. It's her claim that she's got a patent - the number she gave does not return anything, because it's a blatant lie. She claims to be a good Christian yet makes horrid videos using teenagers who have killed themselves to represent how she's been 'bullied' when, in fact, it's her who is the bully. All of this is to protect her cash cow. Now she's claiming to have invented cream soap and whipped soap.
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$70 for an ebook that can't be printed?? I know P. T. Barnum was right, there's a sucker born every minute, but to charge an asinine amount of money to new people who are clueless at how many ways there are to achieve the same result is disgusting to many of us. That is why you see the 'viciousness'. I am on a lot of FB groups helping people - and I would never, for one minute, expect to make a dime off of anyone for that help. The whole thing just stinks. And with that I'll leave everyone to their own thoughts on the matter.
 
I always have a problem with people who try to commoditize everything to make a buck, yet complain when the free market forces comes to bite them on the butt - due to their own actions or their lies and half truths.
 
I watched the whole situation unfold on Facebook and caught on very early on to what the motivations were. It is sad to watch a group of soapers enter into an almost cult like mentality. It is all money driven and religion is being used to garner trust. I check in on occasion to see how things are developing and I am amazed at how naive some people are. I'm not surprised at the backlash. I don't care either way, it's just interesting to watch.
 
I can't speak for others, but mine DO shrink/warp in typical HP fashion. My first "stick blend" HP bars are 6 months old now. They don't seem to shrink/warp as MUCH as bars made with other HP methods, but I'm not going to pretend that it doesn't happen at all. It drives me up the wall when people are not truthful about this stuff.

I've spent the last year trying to solve the warping issue, and it's possible that there simply isn't a solution, but I'm not ready to accept defeat quite yet.

Finally! An honest long-term update/report! Thank you so much for that. :)


IrishLass :)
 
You don't understand the 'viciousness' - it's because of her own words and actions. It's her insistence that it's her method - which is utter crap. Nothing she's done is anything new or revolutionary. It's her claim that she's got a patent - the number she gave does not return anything, because it's a blatant lie. She claims to be a good Christian yet makes horrid videos using teenagers who have killed themselves to represent how she's been 'bullied' when, in fact, it's her who is the bully. All of this is to protect her cash cow.

I saw that deranged rant of hers on youtube and had to turn it off. I guess she'd been kicked out of some facebook groups and was retaliating. Just disgusting...

I blocked any other videos of hers. At this point she could "invent" a soaping method that created chocolate chip cookies as a byproduct - I wouldn't give her a dime or listen to a word.

You know, I was totally willing to give her the benefit of the doubt when I first heard of her "method" and wouldn't begrudge anyone making a little profit off of sharing some knowledge. I happily support SwiftMonkey's charitable eBooks and have recently purchased a recipe to try out from Body Bonbon... but folks passing off dubious/untested methods for exorbitant amounts makes me angry. Seeing that youtube diatribe completely infuriated me.
 
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Wow. I guess Sharon Johnson is quite the polarizing topic!

My comments/review were intended to be about the method, not the person, and I haven't been tracking things on Facebook closely enough to have seen all this madness. When I said I was troubled by how nasty some people have been to her, I was referring to those who were mocking her and basically calling her stupid for making soap the way she does.

It seems there's a lot more drama in all of this than I realized. (Don't drink the Kool-Aid, yo!) Even so, I still think it's important to try to remain civil, no matter how awful somebody else is being. The lack of civility I so often see on Facebook is precisely why I'm not on there very much.

The difference that the method is not new and some people feel that they have been deceived and wasted their money

I didn't know about her, and I wasn't even on any Facebook soaping groups, until somebody posted about her here on the forum. This was right after her initial how-to video was posted, and at that time it was still publicly available. I was curious, so I followed the bread crumbs to Facebook and printed a pdf she'd posted with a written summary of the process. (I think the video and the pdf were taken down sometime after that.) Since I personally did not have to pay money for those basic instructions, I can't really speak for the people who did.

I've seen lots of drama on YouTube regarding SJ and her method. Since she claims to have invented the method (and I vaguely recall some talk of patents or trademarks pending), people that posted videos of themselves making soap this way were bombarded with comments from SJ's followers, demanding that credit be given to SJ as the creator of the method and that it be referred to as SJHP (Sharon Johnson Hot Process) instead of SBHP (Stick Blend Hot Process). This is probably why there's been such a backlash against her.

Reinbeau said (see below) that SJ claims to have invented cream soap and whipped soap. That's just weird, since information on how to make those products has been publicly circulating for a long time, and it's easy to demonstrate that they're not her invention. Does anybody know whether there are videos/materials about the METHOD that pre-date hers? That would make it really easy to settle the question of whether she "invented" it. I will do some searching and report back if I can find anything.

She claims to be a good Christian yet makes horrid videos using teenagers who have killed themselves to represent how she's been 'bullied' when, in fact, it's her who is the bully. All of this is to protect her cash cow. Now she's claiming to have invented cream soap and whipped soap.

I saw that deranged rant of hers on youtube and had to turn it off. I guess she'd been kicked out of some facebook groups and was retaliating. Just disgusting...

I haven't seen this video, but it sounds like many people found it rather distasteful, to put it mildly. As a Christian myself, it's very discouraging when bad behavior is linked to any branch of Christianity -- even when it's not my own particular flavor -- but sadly it seems to happen constantly. (How 'bout that Josh Duggar? What an embarrassment.) I guess the takeaway here is that NOBODY is perfect or "good" (superior) or special, and any "Christian" who claims otherwise isn't reading the Bible very carefully.

Finally! An honest long-term update/report! Thank you so much for that. :)

I'll try to post some pictures if it'll help! I was extremely irritated when I asked for pictures of aged soap on one of these HP Facebook groups and got maybe two replies, both with pictures that I have good reason to believe were actually of fresh soap.
 
She removed the video when she started to get mostly negative comments on YouTube. I have the video on my computer. Nuff said on all that. Jbot, that's the issue, the older soapmakers did things without videoing themselves - of course - this kind of malarkey just wasn't on the radar back then. I am continually appalled at how badly some soapmakers behave, I don't know what happens to cause this, but it's out there, and on Facebook it just can't be avoided, totally. Thankfully it's easy enough to surround yourself with the good soapmakers, which is what I prefer to do.
 
I think I just found out who she is. I'm not going into how Christian she is it isn't the main issue but from what some have said, her alleged actions betray her religion (sorry but I am late to this party and thank God too). So the only thing for me to do is to just familiarize myself with this method, so to speak.

This issue reminds me of a rumor I heard of some guy trying to patent steel drums and the sheer backlash that ensued because of that.

Is her method similar to this?

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJ2ffjIRMak"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJ2ffjIRMak[/ame]
 
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I have left a couple of more FB soapmaking groups over this. I am really done with all the negativity. I just don't have time for all of that anymore, and am simply unwilling to give those folks one more minute of my time. I am still a member of this forum (obviously), and Liquid Soapmakers Yahoo Group, where none of that nonsense is allowed.
 
As far as cream soap and whipped soap ... versions of these products are in soap making manuals and perfumery manuals from the 1800s. (Perfumers were the ones who made the fancy perfumed toilet soaps, hair pomades, creams, etc. Soap makers just made soap.) Not saying the old methods and recipes are exactly the same as nowadays. They didn't have stick blenders or even mechanical stirrers. They also did a lot less cold process method and more "boiled" soap. But the general techniques and methods are there.

Susie -- Lately, I've been seeing a trend away from the intense focus on pH testing and the idea of forcing the LS pH to go lower than is natural and more focus on the zap test and accepting the soap just as it is. I never thought I'd see the day....
 
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